Hi, Ive been puzzling over these three for a while now (though not obsessively) and thought there was probably a good chance someone here might be able to set me straight on at least a few.
Theres only three, a Monadenium and two Dorstenias. (Sorry about some of the sideways photos, they were the right way up in my photo gallery and im worried to somehow mess somthing up with this post since its taken so long to make lol).
The Monadenium was bought from a Spanish ebayer as Monadenium magnificum-Spineless form. It has deeply succulent leaves that are pretty stiff and persistent, sometimes having a semi spiny "blade" running along the central vein on the underside, like other monadeniums and the normal Monadenium magnificum. This line is not always produced on leaves though, the current rosette does not really have them. The stem is roughly quadrangular, loosely spiralled and has nubby downward pointing spines below leaf attachment points (size varies and sometimes they break and round off). It has not flowered for me yet and leafs out in late summer, then holds those leaves until spring.
The first, taller Dorstenia was sold to me as gigas by a U.K ebayer, but I've suspected for a long time now it is just foetida. I really love this plant and it has grown very vigorously in its first summer with me. The leaves are quite shiny but not as crenulated or bullate as D. gigas leaves llok (I have never seen or touched D. gigas so its just my guess), they also have notably long petioles, which gigas does not seem to have. The flowers are quite large for the plant and have long slender enations all around, again unlike gigas flowers which seem to have nubby projections. The stem seems wrong too. I am just guessing foetida because its pretty easy (I had it growing under lights in winter, taking water and leafing out) and I hear the species is very variable, so it seems to fit the vague profile and might just be the most likely option becuase its the most common species available.
The second was actually bought as D. foetida, it is much more diminutive of stem and leaf. It has smaller and slightly crenate leaves, much finer and slightly glossy, the edges turn upward instead of downward, like the first plant. The flowers are much smaller and dont open quite some wide, though it is possibly just behind in terms of phenology. It has been a much more reluctant plant to grow in general and only came into leaf when placed in warm shade with the seedlings in late summer. Even then, only one side grew at first.
A part of my always wondered if I had gotten the two dorstenias mixed up, but I dont think the second really looks anything like D. gigas either.
Anyways, looking for help with all three of these, Ive not gotten responses from the sellers since either.
Thanks
Rory
Looking for some Dorstenia/Monadenium ID help
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Re: Looking for some Dorstenia/Monadenium ID help
Hi Rory,
No 1 is the same as 1 I have that had the same ID, I'd need to double check my label as I vaguely remember Rikus saying it was originally mislabelled.
Neither of the others is gigas, just foetida with maybe a tiny bit of lavranii maybe in No2, no3 d.foetida.
D.gigas has to be large to flower especially in the UK so flowering that small is also a 'give away' and the flowers on gigas are a different shape, old photo's now as I lost all three of my large plants and back to trying to grow some up again. I'd ask for a refund as gigas is normally more expensive than foetida, via ebay &/or paypal
No 1 is the same as 1 I have that had the same ID, I'd need to double check my label as I vaguely remember Rikus saying it was originally mislabelled.
Neither of the others is gigas, just foetida with maybe a tiny bit of lavranii maybe in No2, no3 d.foetida.
D.gigas has to be large to flower especially in the UK so flowering that small is also a 'give away' and the flowers on gigas are a different shape, old photo's now as I lost all three of my large plants and back to trying to grow some up again. I'd ask for a refund as gigas is normally more expensive than foetida, via ebay &/or paypal
Last edited by Tina on Thu Aug 31, 2023 7:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
Tina
varied collection of succulents and cacti but I especially like Euphorbia's, Ariocarpus and variegated agaves.
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varied collection of succulents and cacti but I especially like Euphorbia's, Ariocarpus and variegated agaves.
Bucks, UK
Branch co-ordinator, Northants & MK BCSS https://northants.bcss.org.uk
BCSS Talk team member, contact me- BCSS.Talk@Gmail.com if you want to volunteer or suggest a speaker plz.
Re: Looking for some Dorstenia/Monadenium ID help
Hi, beautiful plant BTW, lovely and fat. shame to have lost it/them. Thx for the help, good to know about the monadenium and I have given up on the refund, partly because it wasnt actually super expensive (giveaway also), and I do enjoy the plant.
Also might as well say here, but the regular M. Magnificum (ca?) I bought from you (yes that's me) is safe and beautiful, quite different from the spineless form. (assuming the king-deadly ebay account is yours).
Also might as well say here, but the regular M. Magnificum (ca?) I bought from you (yes that's me) is safe and beautiful, quite different from the spineless form. (assuming the king-deadly ebay account is yours).
Re: Looking for some Dorstenia/Monadenium ID help
D.Gigas is one of those distinctive plants that looks quite different to the others, shinier leaves and nothing else looks quite like it. It couldn't be confused with D.Foetida but a seller could easily treble the price by selling under the wrong name. Rooted cuttings turn up from time to time, I expect there'll be some at ELK next week. Around £15 to £25 for a small plant would be reasonable. I've never managed to keep them for long as they need winter warmth, maybe grown as a houseplant on a sunny window would be better.
Stuart
Stuart
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Re: Looking for some Dorstenia/Monadenium ID help
Might your Monadenium be arborescens? I used to have a plant of that, and from memory, it looked somewhat similar.
Ralph Martin
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Members visiting the Llyn Peninsula are welcome to visit my collection.
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https://www.rrm.me.uk/Cacti/cacti.html
Members visiting the Llyn Peninsula are welcome to visit my collection.
Swaps and sales at https://www.rrm.me.uk/Cacti/forsale.php
My Field Number Database is at https://www.fieldnos.bcss.org.uk
Re: Looking for some Dorstenia/Monadenium ID help
Ralph, after a v quick Google there are some compelling similarities I must say , il look more later, thx for that idea
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Re: Looking for some Dorstenia/Monadenium ID help
Hi Rory,
Yes its me using hubbies eBay, the new monadenium has Rikus collection data.
I have trimmed one of my gigas and I'm trying to get the cuttings to root but this cold weather is not helping.
Yes its me using hubbies eBay, the new monadenium has Rikus collection data.
I have trimmed one of my gigas and I'm trying to get the cuttings to root but this cold weather is not helping.
Tina
varied collection of succulents and cacti but I especially like Euphorbia's, Ariocarpus and variegated agaves.
Bucks, UK
Branch co-ordinator, Northants & MK BCSS https://northants.bcss.org.uk
BCSS Talk team member, contact me- BCSS.Talk@Gmail.com if you want to volunteer or suggest a speaker plz.
varied collection of succulents and cacti but I especially like Euphorbia's, Ariocarpus and variegated agaves.
Bucks, UK
Branch co-ordinator, Northants & MK BCSS https://northants.bcss.org.uk
BCSS Talk team member, contact me- BCSS.Talk@Gmail.com if you want to volunteer or suggest a speaker plz.